The quiz below tests how good a job McVeigh did in impersonating someone like Ernest Hancock, whose Viper Reserves web site said “the likely perpetrators [of the OKC bombing] had closer ties to the police state and NO ties to any militia group”. Viper Reserves was set up to defend Viper Militia members like Dean Pleasant, a 1994 LP candidate in Arizona who was jailed in 1996 after stockpiling ammonium nitrate and creating a videotape surveilling federal buildings and advising how explosives could bring them down. The New York Times quoted Hancock defending the videotape as "educational".
See if you can tell which statements were made by McVeigh, and which by Hancock. Post your guesses in the comments where you see this contest, and I'll score them. The first person who scores 100% can decide which Hancock opponent in the Chair race gets my $100 donation.
- If you're not at least a little uncomfortable with your position, it isn't radical enough. Take the most extreme position you can.
- I'm concerned about a United Nations takeover and establishment of a single world government designed to place severe limits on individual freedom.
- There will be some bloodshed -- how much? Are you sure you want to go this far? It's not a battle of who has the most guns. It's a battle of who has the most heart, and who has the most will.
- There will be a single currency, a single police force -- one all-powerful central government for everyone on the planet.
- So now it's how many cans of Campbell's Soup can you get? How much water do you got? How many friends do you have? How much land can you plow? What's coming can not be stopped.
- There are over 300,000 names on a Cray Supercomputer in Brussels of "possible and suspected subversives and terrorists" in the U.S., all ranked in order of threat.
- It's gonna get to the point of Big Brother. It's gonna get that bad. And if it's not done with video and audio, it may be with electromagnetic waves, are they gonna have a certain frequency on your power grid?
- At Waco, the feds picked a windy day on purpose so the building would catch fire quickly.
- They want the building to go down. They need a bridge to blow up. It justifies their existence.
- The CIA flies drugs into the U.S. to fund many covert operations.
- The Declaration of Independence had absolutely nothing to do with voting. It was all about what happens when voting doesn't work. You will never vote yourself free.
This quiz was inspired by the Al Gore Or The Unabomber? quiz. See also my Rothbard or the Unabomber? article.
As a bonus, here is video that was a front-page "featured article" on Hancock's FreedomsPhoenix site. It was an attempt to "pre-empt" the "lies and propaganda" of the recent MSNBC documentary featuring McVeigh's extensive jailhouse confessions.
5 comments:
A Note From Ernest Hancock to LP National Delegates
ernesthancock.org
(BTW – I am writing from a small caravan going to St. Louis and we are east of Gallup, New Mexico on I-40 right now, 10:00pm Wednesday. We plan on driving straight through so that we are at the hotel in time for the Suns/Lakers game Thursday night)
Those that know me, and others that have witnessed my previous efforts, likely understand why I do the things that I do and what I aim to accomplish in St. Louis.
Very soon (if not already) the vast majority of Americans (along with the rest of the planet) will come to the realization that they are all victims of the largest swindle/robbery in human history,… and they will be searching for an accurate explanation. Libertarianism provides a very useful road map to what happened, who/what was responsible and how to avoid the same mistakes in the future. But ‘off ramps’ to detours that take us meandering through the same unprincipled wilderness that got us in this mess will be of no use to a ‘Generation Next’ that has a detailed 3D online map in their hip pocket.
This decentralization of information is only beginning to be felt by a liberty starved planet and attempts to negotiate our principles for a place at the establishment’s media table will backfire just as it did in the 2008 presidential election cycle.
Another election cycle of LPUS’ documented compromises on libertarian principle will make it very unlikely, as a political party, we’ll legitimately be able to compete at a national level in the future as a standard bearer for libertarianism. I am of the opinion that information availability is so ubiquitous now, that the ‘Liberty Nexus’ that was the best trait of the LPUS will be replaced by too many sources of contacts and information to keep track of. Politics is about to be replaced with communities that will attempt to create the freedom denied them by layers of government,… without asking permission.
What if I really really believe that the future will have fresh young minds embracing libertarianism as the only consistent and understandable path to peace and prosperity? Then positioning ourselves so that we are the obvious destination for those seeking exactly what we offer is a very good idea. Since many (enough) that I associate with are also of this opinion, we chose to make our advocacy of no-compromise libertarianism a blazing torch everywhere possible.
In the near future, freedom communities will likely be virtual and without borders or boundaries. Governments, states, countries and even languages will have less and less to do with an individual’s interactions than a simple listing on the contemporary cousin of craigslist with servers based in orbit or on the Moon.
Libertarianism is ‘the philosophy for the stars’ and to think in smaller terms is an abandonment of the future for the LPUS. The future is why St. Louis is so important to many that support my effort. The economic tragedy coming, that is only in the early stages, provides a rare opportunity to help many millions,… not just when they need it the most, but when they are also seeking it the most. And they have already abandoned the ‘lame-stream media,… the media that is soooo last century’ in search of the truth.
We have done our best to make our advocacy clear, and our long track record of principled activism has accomplished several things; government abuses of individual rights have been exposed while branding us as defenders of individual freedom, available resources in support of such advocacy are directed towards the most effective uses of those resources, inspiration of an entirely new generation of freedom activists have been continually nurtured.
I am prepared and eager to represent the future and inspire a flood of fresh and energetic activists, that are already experienced and networked with each other, to come and make use of the Libertarian Party at a national/international level to free as many minds as possible in as short a time as possible to save as many lives as possible. ...
1. Hancock (from L. Neil Smith)
2. McVeigh
3. Hancock
4. McVeigh
5. Hancock
6. McVeigh
7. Hancock
8. McVeigh
9. Hancock
10. McVeigh
11. Hancock
You made this too easy! Anyway, I'm actually a big Hancock supporter. Ernie "gets it", and he would be able to bring in the Ron Paul people and enthusiasm. He would be a great chair for the party. Electing some of the New Path slate would be good too. Close down Watergate, ax the bureaucracy, and let's start doing some real outreach and having some fun!
And I say you should give the $100 to Ernie. He'll probably use it for Tyvek. :)
While I've no "dog" in the whole LPUS "hunt", I happen to know something about OKC as told to me by a federal contractor (and former friend of nearly 20 years).
On the morning of 4/19/1995, he was on the phone to a federal agent and the calls was interrupted by the news of the Murrah building bombing. The agent came back on the line and told my (then) friend that agents on the scene were "walking on eggshells" because of all the unexploded ordnance . . . including "unexploded det cord wrapped around the concrete pillars".
This, on its own, totally disproves the ANFO truck bomb story as being solely responsible for the Murrah building damage. It also points to perpetrators other than McVeigh and Nichols -- perpetrators with quality training and access to sophisticated equipment.
It substantiates what USAF Gen. Partin has always alleged about OKC, that there were internal charges.
For having spoken too freely about it, that particular federal agent was given a punitive posting in the rural West. To my knowledge he has not spoken of it since.
I eventually ended my friendship with the federal contractor because he refused to go public with this information, all the while castigating "conspiracy theorists" and the 9/11 truthers as "tin-foil hatty".
So, before any of you Pollyanna libertarians are so quick to toss aside evidence of government complicity in such events, do your own homework first. And don't be so naive.
Ernie Hancock may occasionally go a bit far, but Brian Holtz doesn't go far enough.
So this anonymous claim reporting hearsay from an unnamed source about an unnamed federal agent is supposed to "totally disprove the ANFO truck bomb story as being solely responsible for the Murrah building damage"? ROTFLMAO
Helmuth, the prize was won the first day, over on IPR.
No, it's not supposed to prove it to you, Brian. You are predisposed against government complicity in such events. I.e., you haven't the ears to hear such things.
btw, I am not "Helmuth". Rather, I am very well-known in the freedom movement, having spoken at several LP events over many years. I have only once publicly mentioned what I learned, and without divulging any names. Sorry, but I've not going to divulge them here on your site.
I doubt that you would believe it even if I identified myself, the identity of the federal contractor who told me, and agency/title/location of the federal agent who told him.
I also doubt that you would believe even an .mp3 file of the relevant 2007 conversation in which the federal contractor prefaced OKC as a "travesty" before he told me about the det cord.
Even in the McVeigh files video which you mockingly host on your site, there are 4/19/1995 local TV news reports of secondary explosives remaining in the building -- reports which were never repeated, much less followed up on. (To you, they must be lying or grossly misinformed.)
The alleged ANFO bomb is a joke: how it was purportedly constructed within 4 hours in the confines of a 24' box truck without breathers to protect against the nitromethane fumes, the internal column damage it could not have possibly caused on its own, and the utter lack of unignited prills everywhere. Explosive experts around the world are amazed that anybody buys the official version.
So -- no, Brian -- I don't expect you to believe anything. Governments always play fair and never stoop to conspiracies, right? False flag operations? "Why, my goodness, never! That's paranoid talk!"
The fact that our society is becoming quite the surveillance state is just a matter of bureaucratic accretion, eh? Nobody is planning to, for all practical purposes, enslave the citizenry -- it's just working out that way . . . on accident through unconnected events and regulations.
Oh, and speaking of Ernie Hancock's "crazy" advice: you quote him from 4/2009 urging people to get out of the stock market. (Ooops! Today, he looks like a prophet on that.)
He predicted violent uprisings due to statist economic measures. (Greece, anybody?)
Sorry, Brian, but aren't events beginning to prove Ernie's point?
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